00:00:01: Cultural differences between the Brits

00:00:04: and the Germans must be, like, the most popular topic in certainly

00:00:09: my Instagram feed and all the messages I've been receiving, people want to know,

00:00:14: how is it really like the unembellished, genuine truth?

00:00:21: And last episode, if you were there,

00:00:23: we started talking about out little things that irritate us or annoy us

00:00:29: in a social and professional context, trying to be specific and not as

00:00:36: stereotypical because, well, you and I, we've both lived in each other's

00:00:41: respective countries and worked with Brits and Germans for decades.

00:00:46: And so there are many little things

00:00:50: the Germans don't get about the Brits and the other way around.

00:00:54: And we always sit in the middle and we sort of build the bridge.

00:00:57: No, hang on.

00:01:01: This isn't war.

00:01:03: How many times have we been there like that?

00:01:05: Just relax. Yeah, lag.

00:01:07: Step off. Breathe.

00:01:11: Fired up. Beautifully put.

00:01:14: Yeah. Yes, please.

00:01:15: So last episode, you've given us a little teaser into that

00:01:22: there's more coming.

00:01:23: Yeah.

00:01:24: I like the fact we're doing this so off the cuff.

00:01:27: It is completely unscripted,

00:01:28: because as we were talking in the previous episode, it suddenly dawned on me.

00:01:32: I thought, shit, that's a great example.

00:01:34: So I touched on very briefly what I call

00:01:38: a lack of social cohesion, the glue that binds.

00:01:42: And I'm not talking about the laws

00:01:43: that say, thou shalt not mow down a little old lady because she's

00:01:48: counting her fucking coins at the supermarket, and you're running ten

00:01:52: minutes late and the boss is going to ream your ass for not being in there on time.

00:01:55: Okay, I'm not talking about that kind of social cohesion.

00:01:58: I'm talking about the finer details that don't get given anywhere.

00:02:05: Well, they're just not talked about

00:02:06: because I think more often than not, people just are unaware of them.

00:02:10: So we touched on the idea of personal

00:02:12: indemnity insurance, private Haftpflichtversicherung,

00:02:15: the whole idea that you have to indemnify yourself

00:02:20: in the event of, say, spilling wine on your friend's carpet.

00:02:22: And we touched on that, and I said then, and I'll say it now.

00:02:27: I think if you're worried your friends are going to bill you for wine on their

00:02:30: carpet, you need to get some new friends, because they're pretty shitty friends.

00:02:33: And while I was talking about, or rather listening to you,

00:02:35: and I was actually listening to you, I wasn't just waiting for my turn to speak.

00:02:38: Right. Okay.

00:02:41: When she kind of stopped banging on.

00:02:43: Because I've got to speak, you know, I'm not like that, another great example

00:02:47: came to me, and it's more of a professional example.

00:02:52: And before I say that professional

00:02:54: example, I want to make clear intercultural differences or cultural

00:02:57: differences, or has the potential to be a very wishy-washy subject.

00:03:03: Of course. Fluffy.

00:03:05: And again, if you go onto LinkedIn, there are people falling over themselves

00:03:08: to talk about cultural differences or lack thereof.

00:03:12: And it's all very, very safe, and it's not specific.

00:03:15: And what I want with you is to offer real

00:03:18: specifics so that anybody listening to this, anybody watching this can go, shit.

00:03:22: Right? That makes sense.

00:03:24: Okay.

00:03:24: And the example that came to mind while I was listening to you was something that I

00:03:30: learned while I was doing my MBA in the Euro-FH in Hamburg.

00:03:36: And great time, actually an expensive time

00:03:38: in my life, and it did bankrupt me, but it was worth it.

00:03:41: And it was while I was doing the components international law.

00:03:48: And I was very fortunate to be well

00:03:51: acquainted with a top lawyer in Germany for other reasons.

00:03:56: Shout out to Dirk Schwane, if you're listening to this.

00:03:58: I doubt that he is, but if maybe he is, I really liked Dirk.

00:04:01: He really took his time with me and he

00:04:03: coached me on some points, and I was very grateful to him.

00:04:06: And I once heard him say:

00:04:09: “Daniel, das musst du aber wissen.

00:04:12: Informationen sind Holschulden.”

00:04:14: and I was like, what the fuck is a Holschuld?

00:04:17: I have no idea what this is.

00:04:19: And he walked me through it.

00:04:20: So I suppose for non German speakers, the concept of Holschuld is so

00:04:27: quintessentially German in a professional context, and it does not exist in the UK.

00:04:32: Would you translate it, first of all?

00:04:34: Well, it's beautiful because it involves

00:04:35: the word Schuld, which can mean guilt or debt, right.

00:04:41: Owing in any kind of capacity.

00:04:43: Right, Holschuld.

00:04:45: So the expression “Informationen sind Holschulden” is,

00:04:50: I suppose, off the cuff, best translated as something like:

00:04:54: “information in any form is something you are obligated to go and get yourself”.

00:05:01: Nobody's going to bring it to you.

00:05:03: You have to know to ask the question, or you have to know where to look for it.

00:05:07: You have to know that you need it. Beautiful.

00:05:11: Unknown, right? Exactly.

00:05:13: That's right.

00:05:14: If it's an unknown unknown, like, for example, you were given a piece

00:05:19: of paper explaining the procedure for doing something,

00:05:23: and in that explanation it contains a passcode, for example, to a door,

00:05:29: say a six number letter combinations thing on the door.

00:05:34: You are obligated

00:05:36: from a German perspective to have read that information, to absorbed it all,

00:05:40: and to know that you need that passcode for that door.

00:05:43: And if you get there and you either didn't

00:05:46: read that section or you forgot it, what's your problem?

00:05:50: Because it's your obligation to go and get that information.

00:05:53: Contrast that with the experience of working in a British professional setting.

00:06:00: The Brits, the English in particular,

00:06:02: and myself personally all the time, as I'm sure you'll testify to.

00:06:06: I love to overshare.

00:06:08: I love giving people just that little bit of informational toot toot, just on top.

00:06:14: Go, oh, just so you know,

00:06:16: this might come in handy to the point where it really does wind you up.

00:06:21: Just shut it and let's go.

00:06:23: Because they don't need to know what you ate for breakfast.

00:06:26: They don't need to know if your dog's happy.

00:06:28: Okay? And they don't need to know about XYZ.

00:06:30: And that's a valid point, because I do overshare in those respects.

00:06:33: But an Englishman would go, oh, by the way, you've probably read the information.

00:06:36: That door's got a six letter combination on it.

00:06:39: Did you see the pin code? They would.

00:06:42: And I completely get now why you're like this, right?

00:06:46: But at first I thought, why is he always oversharing?

00:06:48: Like, I come from a family where you don't waste breath, you don't waste…

00:06:53: Was sagen die in deiner Familie?

00:06:56: Keine Luft verbraten.

00:07:00: So don't waste the air.

00:07:02: If you don't have anything to say, don't say it.

00:07:04: So we're not talkers.

00:07:06: In my family, coffee and cake is

00:07:09: probably one of the most quiet, at

00:07:11: least on one side of the family I can think of.

00:07:13: We're not talkers. We're not sharers at all.

00:07:16: The other side of the family

00:07:18: They don’t know anything about each other. Yeah, it's true.

00:07:19: And then leave.

00:07:21: So when I met you, I was always like,

00:07:23: why is he like, this was private or personal or irrelevant at best.

00:07:28: Why is he always explaining everything?

00:07:31: Why is he telling people about that itch?

00:07:32: They’re strangers! Like, what's he doing?

00:07:36: And now I totally appreciate

00:07:41: this British mannerism, again, the social glue.

00:07:45: Like, hey, just FYI,

00:07:48: just so we're on the same page, or just so you're not struggling,

00:07:51: in two minutes’ time, I'm just going to let you know.

00:07:55: And it's so lovely. Thank you.

00:07:57: I'm really glad you like, and it is a real thing.

00:07:59: I don't want to talk about fluffy,

00:08:01: generic, half-baked ideas that could or could not apply to a nation.

00:08:06: This is a real terms, everyday occurrence that I experience.

00:08:10: And just to be clear, there are people in England who will go

00:08:14: out of their way to not help you, to not share information.

00:08:17: And I've always wanted to do this in a very public setting,

00:08:20: use the special word that I reserve for particular occasions.

00:08:23: People like that who don't share information or will withhold it,

00:08:28: knowing that in all probability you're going to trip up.

00:08:31: We call them cunts, and people don't like them.

00:08:34: They don't get invited to parties,

00:08:36: they don't have family and friends, and they die quite lonely.

00:08:40: So I have no time for those people.

00:08:44: And you quickly work out who they are

00:08:47: in an office setting, and you avoid them at all costs.

00:08:50: And it's quite liberating, actually, to use the most offensive word

00:08:53: in the English language to describe them, because that's what they are.

00:08:56: They're cunts, and people will not give them the time of day.

00:09:00: So that is the single biggest bugbear I would have.

00:09:03: And again, one of the reasons I choose not to work in Germany anymore,

00:09:09: because people are, in my experience,

00:09:15: not willing to go above and beyond.

00:09:19: They're just not.

00:09:20: And it's deeply ingrained in the psyche.

00:09:24: I always feel like there's a bit of a

00:09:27: mean streak, I suppose, when you think about the word

00:09:30: Schadenfreude is used in English, we call it Schadenfreude.

00:09:36: There's always this, like,

00:09:38: I'm going to eat my imaginative popcorn and sit and wait till they trip.

00:09:43: Beautifully put.

00:09:47: But conversely, that's why so many project

00:09:49: managers you work with, when you give them a little heads up,

00:09:52: because you're running late for something or that you need longer,

00:09:57: you're having to work extra hard on a particularly difficult job,

00:10:02: or the formatting was bad or whatever, and so you're running behind schedule

00:10:07: and you let them know and they are so like, wow, thank you.

00:10:12: There's a great communication, because there's communication at every

00:10:16: turn, like, every step of the way, we communicate.

00:10:19: Absolutely.

00:10:21: Which is something Germans don't do, in my experience.

00:10:24: And of course, there's great examples I

00:10:26: can think of right now where the opposite holds true.

00:10:30: So always with a pinch of salt, I suppose. But sure.

00:10:34: In general,

00:10:36: just FYI, just to let you know, because I don't want to keep you waiting.

00:10:44: That's a massive difference.

00:10:45: I agree.

00:10:48: The onus is on you and not on me for sharing everything.

00:10:53: So I'm going to let you get there and then let you fail and struggle.

00:10:56: Yes. For me, that is probably the single

00:11:00: biggest difference, the most tangible example of where our two

00:11:05: great nations differ in a professional context.

00:11:11: I find it sad.

00:11:12: I find it sad because it is something.

00:11:16: Well, I've never heard anybody talk about

00:11:18: it on any kind of format or any kind of dialogue about cultural differences.

00:11:25: Nobody addresses that.

00:11:27: Do you think that when we talk about this, so if you can't understand me,

00:11:32: or if you haven't got the context, you need to understand me, that's your fault.

00:11:37: That kind of mentality has something to do

00:11:40: with why so many Germans just go ahead and translate their text themselves.

00:11:44: And they go, well, if they don't get what we're doing, it's their problem.

00:11:49: And why so many websites are so average

00:11:51: and why, like in your dad's case, who's just ordered this massive new

00:11:56: irrigation system for his beautiful garden from an Austrian or German company?

00:12:01: German speaking company. German speaking.

00:12:03: Austrian company, I think.

00:12:04: And the English communication was so shocking

00:12:08: that the poor man had to phone us for us to help him understand what they meant.

00:12:14: Specifically in this particular case, they sent him documents in English

00:12:18: that had clearly been googled or chucked through DeepL or whatever.

00:12:21: And the machine, being a machine, missed the context of KW, Kalenderwoche.

00:12:27: The concept of Kalenderwoche (calendar week)

00:12:29: yes, it exists in this country.

00:12:31: It is not used outside of perhaps the most

00:12:35: niche engineering or logistical supply chain environment.

00:12:40: If you talk to somebody on the street

00:12:42: about KW, CW 21, they'll be like, what the fuck are you talking about?

00:12:47: Nobody. And again, I work with marketing teams

00:12:52: and sales teams, and calendar week is exclusively used.

00:12:59: Like, we only ever think in calendar weeks, interestingly.

00:13:04: But when we switch to English to include,

00:13:06: like, an international team, they're completely lost.

00:13:10: You can see it. That's right.

00:13:12: It's above the heads, because why did you give them the specific date?

00:13:16: Yes, exactly.

00:13:17: And so in the case of the documents that my dad got with his irrigation

00:13:20: system, he spent a week trying to work it out before he gave in and called.

00:13:25: When I explained it to him, it was like… kilowatts.

00:13:29: Right? So from the perspective of that Austrian

00:13:32: company communicating with a British customer, I don't understand why their

00:13:40: immediate response or their immediate thought process wasn't:

00:13:43: Do you know what? International customer.

00:13:45: Let's just pick up the phone to somebody

00:13:47: who might know any pointers, anything we should or shouldn't do,

00:13:52: or better still, we've written this, we've chucked it through DeepL,

00:13:56: but we just want to make sure it's okay before we send it.

00:13:59: And somebody would have looked at it and went, well, the translation is fine

00:14:02: because the machines are really good, but KW doesn't make any sense.

00:14:06: If you are a company whether a German, Austrian, Swiss based company

00:14:13: with international customers, it simply is not good enough to deal

00:14:19: with them, communicate them as if they were based in Germany.

00:14:22: And by, if I've talked about this a lot,

00:14:26: and I'm going to talk about this a lot going forward, if you are a professional

00:14:30: based in Germany and you're looking to apply for a new job, for example,

00:14:33: and the prospective company says, hey, you look great.

00:14:36: Yeah.

00:14:37: Submit your CV in English. Okay.

00:14:39: Do not write or translate your German CV because if somebody comes to you and says,

00:14:44: we want your CV in English, they're not asking for a translation,

00:14:47: they're asking for an internationally compliant CV curriculum vitae in German,

00:14:54: in British English or American English, and that's an entirely different ballgame.

00:14:58: So, yeah, pet peeves.

00:15:01: It never ceases to amaze me how many people or companies go out.

00:15:05: It'll be okay. And you really should talk to people

00:15:09: who bridge both cultures linguistically, professionally.

00:15:13: It's important. It's essential.

00:15:15: Yes.

00:15:17: Which brings me to my next topic.

00:15:19: I’m conscious of the fact we've hit in the time limit here.

00:15:23: Yes.

00:15:23: So this next episode is going to be about subtle differences yet again,

00:15:30: but being specific and giving you a professional and social context.

00:15:35: And we're going to dive in, I suppose, a little bit deeper still.

00:15:39: So get your diving kit ready and we'll see you next week.

00:15:43: Amazing. Yeah.

00:15:44: Wonderful. Thank you.

00:15:46: Bye bye.